Green Mountain Energy


Pat Magee
 

For those of us with GME:

It seems that GME has become greedy. Effective when my current contract expires they are discontinuing credits above the level of consumption meaning that a negative balance will no longer be allowed. Note in the attachment the 2nd paragraph says "... however, that credit will be capped at your monthly usage from the grid." Additionally they are adding a $9.95 base charge I don't currently have.

The design of my solar rig was based on the fact I would get a 1-to-1 credit for my overage. I'm interested in hearing from those of you with experience from other retail electric providers that do net metering properly from the consumer's point of view.

My thanks,

Pat Magee


Fred Anders
 

GME: "There's no cancellation fee to sign up for this plan before your current one ends." Go figure!  :)

Rhythm's "Solar Buyback 12" is currently the only plan that offers 1:1 buyback with rollover bill credits.

For a list of all buyback plan options and a free analysis for your home, see https://www.texaspowerguide.com/solar-buyback-plans-texas/


thewineprince
 

What does the 12 mean? A 12 month commitment?

Sent from ProtonMail for iOS


On Fri, Oct 1, 2021 at 11:57 AM, Fred Anders <fjanders1@...> wrote:
GME: "There's no cancellation fee to sign up for this plan before your current one ends." Go figure!  :)

Rhythm's "Solar Buyback 12" is currently the only plan that offers 1:1 buyback with rollover bill credits.

For a list of all buyback plan options and a free analysis for your home, see https://www.texaspowerguide.com/solar-buyback-plans-texas/



Fred Anders
 

On Fri, Oct 1, 2021 at 10:21 AM, thewineprince wrote:
What does the 12 mean? A 12 month commitment?
Correct, with a $10 per remaining month early cancellation fee.


Jim Cochran
 

yes and GM calls it their "New and Improved " plan.  I am going to switch over to Rhythm Energy though I wonder how many years they will keep the full net metering.


On Thu, Sep 30, 2021 at 3:41 PM Pat Magee <pat_magee@...> wrote:
For those of us with GME:

It seems that GME has become greedy. Effective when my current contract
expires they are discontinuing credits above the level of consumption
meaning that a negative balance will no longer be allowed. Note in the
attachment the 2nd paragraph says "... however, that credit will be
capped at your monthly usage from the grid." Additionally they are
adding a $9.95 base charge I don't currently have.

The design of my solar rig was based on the fact I would get a 1-to-1
credit for my overage. I'm interested in hearing from those of you with
experience from other retail electric providers that do net metering
properly from the consumer's point of view.

My thanks,

Pat Magee






w_h_3@...
 

Called Rhythm..their 1:1 plan has electricity price that is sadly around 6 cents more per kWh than their normal plans, which I think is in ballpark of GM or even more.  They do offer buyback in their regular plans but of only the energy charge, not the delivery charge.  I don’t know if Green Mountain even offers that.

Will

On Oct 3, 2021 6:08 PM, Jim Cochran <jimcochran.jd@...> wrote:
yes and GM calls it their "New and Improved " plan.  I am going to switch over to Rhythm Energy though I wonder how many years they will keep the full net metering.

On Thu, Sep 30, 2021 at 3:41 PM Pat Magee <pat_magee@...> wrote:
For those of us with GME:

It seems that GME has become greedy. Effective when my current contract
expires they are discontinuing credits above the level of consumption
meaning that a negative balance will no longer be allowed. Note in the
attachment the 2nd paragraph says "... however, that credit will be
capped at your monthly usage from the grid." Additionally they are
adding a $9.95 base charge I don't currently have.

The design of my solar rig was based on the fact I would get a 1-to-1
credit for my overage. I'm interested in hearing from those of you with
experience from other retail electric providers that do net metering
properly from the consumer's point of view.

My thanks,

Pat Magee







Dan Lepinski, P.E.
 

A "delivery charge" (officially "Transmission and Distribution fee", or "T&D"), is exempt from being credited by the retail electric provider as part of a renewable buy-back plan. T&D costs are imposed by Oncor or other T&D utility (depending on your location), and are passed through from the T&D to your retail provider, who then sends them on to you. Oncor isn't allowed to generate or sell electricity. Consequently, they can't offer credit for something they don't provide.

On the brighter side, when electrical energy consumption decreases as a result of solar energy equipment and/or conservation measures, the T&D charge also goes down, so there is at least some indirect savings on the T&D fee in that respect.

Dan

On 10/4/21 9:09 AM, w_h_3@hotmail.com wrote:
Called Rhythm..their 1:1 plan has electricity price that is sadly around 6 cents more per kWh than their normal plans, which I think is in ballpark of GM or even more.  They do offer buyback in their regular plans but of only the energy charge, not the delivery charge.  I don’t know if Green Mountain even offers that.

Will

On Oct 3, 2021 6:08 PM, Jim Cochran <jimcochran.jd@gmail.com> wrote:

yes and GM calls it their "New and Improved " plan.  I am going to switch over to Rhythm Energy though I wonder how many years they will keep the full net metering.

On Thu, Sep 30, 2021 at 3:41 PM Pat Magee <pat_magee@hotmail.com <mailto:pat_magee@hotmail.com>> wrote:

For those of us with GME:

It seems that GME has become greedy. Effective when my current contract
expires they are discontinuing credits above the level of consumption
meaning that a negative balance will no longer be allowed. Note in the
attachment the 2nd paragraph says "... however, that credit will be
capped at your monthly usage from the grid." Additionally they are
adding a $9.95 base charge I don't currently have.

The design of my solar rig was based on the fact I would get a 1-to-1
credit for my overage. I'm interested in hearing from those of you with
experience from other retail electric providers that do net metering
properly from the consumer's point of view.

My thanks,

Pat Magee


Larry
 

Regarding Oncor's T&D per kWh charge - When my system exports electricity and goes to one of my closest neighbors, Oncor recovers a full T&D kWh rate charge from that neighbor for a kWh hour of electricity that only had to be delivered 50-100 feet, the same rate they get for delivering a kWh of electricity from hundreds of miles away. Should I maybe getting some of that per kWh T&D rate credited back to me from Oncor - thru my REP? I think that is how Green Mountain Energy used to consider it......


Fred Anders
 

On Mon, Oct 4, 2021 at 07:09 AM, <w_h_3@...> wrote:
Called Rhythm..their 1:1 plan has electricity price that is sadly around 6 cents more per kWh than their normal plans, which I think is in ballpark of GM or even more.  They do offer buyback in their regular plans but of only the energy charge, not the delivery charge.  I don’t know if Green Mountain even offers that.
If your system offsets 100% or more of your annual usage (i.e. your exported kWhs exceed your imported kWhs), then it doesn't matter what 1:1 ¢/kWh rate they charge since you'll never pay it. (Even if you only offset most -- but not all -- of your consumption, a high-rate 1:1 plan often still works out to be the best option.)

GME's [unadvertised] "Renewable Rewards Essential" plan is similar to Rhythm's "Texas Breeze" plans in that it charges energy+delivery in, and only credits for energy out. But the GME plan doesn't roll over credits month to month.


w_h_3@...
 

True, unfortunately my system is sized so that I still have to purchase a pretty significant amount, especially since I bought two EVs.  I have only had a negative monthly bill a handful of times under GME's 1:1 plan the past 4 years.  Although I do sell quite a lot, the increased purchase price is more important for my situation than the change to not allow monthly rollover.  When my current contract expires it will be a tricky decision.

Will

On Oct 4, 2021 10:47 AM, Fred Anders <fjanders1@...> wrote:
On Mon, Oct 4, 2021 at 07:09 AM, <w_h_3@...> wrote:
Called Rhythm..their 1:1 plan has electricity price that is sadly around 6 cents more per kWh than their normal plans, which I think is in ballpark of GM or even more.  They do offer buyback in their regular plans but of only the energy charge, not the delivery charge.  I don’t know if Green Mountain even offers that.
If your system offsets 100% or more of your annual usage (i.e. your exported kWhs exceed your imported kWhs), then it doesn't matter what 1:1 ¢/kWh rate they charge since you'll never pay it. (Even if you only offset most -- but not all -- of your consumption, a high-rate 1:1 plan often still works out to be the best option.)

GME's [unadvertised] "Renewable Rewards Essential" plan is similar to Rhythm's "Texas Breeze" plans in that it charges energy+delivery in, and only credits for energy out. But the GME plan doesn't roll over credits month to month.


Jim Cochran
 

Correct the fact that they now do it on a billing cycle monthly means that you don’t carry your surplus from the spa fall or spring into the summer so that you can even out the year to a net of 0.  If the cycle were on a yearly basis instead of monthly then it would be a little more equitable

So one question to me is with the excess electricity that they make in the spring and fall do they just sell it and profit off your generation?  Probably yes

So I guess the answer in the spring and fall is to run your lights and television continuously and consume as much electricity as you can

Sent from Jim Cochran

On Oct 4, 2021, at 12:46 PM, w_h_3@... wrote:


True, unfortunately my system is sized so that I still have to purchase a pretty significant amount, especially since I bought two EVs.  I have only had a negative monthly bill a handful of times under GME's 1:1 plan the past 4 years.  Although I do sell quite a lot, the increased purchase price is more important for my situation than the change to not allow monthly rollover.  When my current contract expires it will be a tricky decision.

Will

On Oct 4, 2021 10:47 AM, Fred Anders <fjanders1@...> wrote:
On Mon, Oct 4, 2021 at 07:09 AM, <w_h_3@...> wrote:
Called Rhythm..their 1:1 plan has electricity price that is sadly around 6 cents more per kWh than their normal plans, which I think is in ballpark of GM or even more.  They do offer buyback in their regular plans but of only the energy charge, not the delivery charge.  I don’t know if Green Mountain even offers that.
If your system offsets 100% or more of your annual usage (i.e. your exported kWhs exceed your imported kWhs), then it doesn't matter what 1:1 ¢/kWh rate they charge since you'll never pay it. (Even if you only offset most -- but not all -- of your consumption, a high-rate 1:1 plan often still works out to be the best option.)

GME's [unadvertised] "Renewable Rewards Essential" plan is similar to Rhythm's "Texas Breeze" plans in that it charges energy+delivery in, and only credits for energy out. But the GME plan doesn't roll over credits month to month.


R. Michael Martin
 

“...run your lights and television continuously and consume as much electricity as you can.”  <<<Surely not at that is counter to the overall direction and mentality of reduce/reuse of clean energy folks (guessing you were kidding ;-)  

Let’s advocate for fair consumer policies and REP offerings for solar users and seek reduction and more efficiencies in overall power use.


On Oct 4, 2021, at 16:30, Jim Cochran via groups.io <jimcochran.jd@...> wrote:

Correct the fact that they now do it on a billing cycle monthly means that you don’t carry your surplus from the spa fall or spring into the summer so that you can even out the year to a net of 0.  If the cycle were on a yearly basis instead of monthly then it would be a little more equitable

So one question to me is with the excess electricity that they make in the spring and fall do they just sell it and profit off your generation?  Probably yes

So I guess the answer in the spring and fall is to run your lights and television continuously and consume as much electricity as you can

Sent from Jim Cochran

On Oct 4, 2021, at 12:46 PM, w_h_3@... wrote:


True, unfortunately my system is sized so that I still have to purchase a pretty significant amount, especially since I bought two EVs.  I have only had a negative monthly bill a handful of times under GME's 1:1 plan the past 4 years.  Although I do sell quite a lot, the increased purchase price is more important for my situation than the change to not allow monthly rollover.  When my current contract expires it will be a tricky decision.

Will

On Oct 4, 2021 10:47 AM, Fred Anders <fjanders1@...> wrote:
On Mon, Oct 4, 2021 at 07:09 AM, <w_h_3@...> wrote:
Called Rhythm..their 1:1 plan has electricity price that is sadly around 6 cents more per kWh than their normal plans, which I think is in ballpark of GM or even more.  They do offer buyback in their regular plans but of only the energy charge, not the delivery charge.  I don’t know if Green Mountain even offers that.
If your system offsets 100% or more of your annual usage (i.e. your exported kWhs exceed your imported kWhs), then it doesn't matter what 1:1 ¢/kWh rate they charge since you'll never pay it. (Even if you only offset most -- but not all -- of your consumption, a high-rate 1:1 plan often still works out to be the best option.)

GME's [unadvertised] "Renewable Rewards Essential" plan is similar to Rhythm's "Texas Breeze" plans in that it charges energy+delivery in, and only credits for energy out. But the GME plan doesn't roll over credits month to month.



Lissa
 

Guess you could always mine Bitcoin like up in Denton.......  just kidding  ; |

Lissa

On Monday, October 4, 2021, 4:41:51 PM CDT, R. Michael Martin <mm@...> wrote:


“...run your lights and television continuously and consume as much electricity as you can.”  <<<Surely not at that is counter to the overall direction and mentality of reduce/reuse of clean energy folks (guessing you were kidding ;-)  

Let’s advocate for fair consumer policies and REP offerings for solar users and seek reduction and more efficiencies in overall power use.


On Oct 4, 2021, at 16:30, Jim Cochran via groups.io <jimcochran.jd@...> wrote:

Correct the fact that they now do it on a billing cycle monthly means that you don’t carry your surplus from the spa fall or spring into the summer so that you can even out the year to a net of 0.  If the cycle were on a yearly basis instead of monthly then it would be a little more equitable

So one question to me is with the excess electricity that they make in the spring and fall do they just sell it and profit off your generation?  Probably yes

So I guess the answer in the spring and fall is to run your lights and television continuously and consume as much electricity as you can

Sent from Jim Cochran

On Oct 4, 2021, at 12:46 PM, w_h_3@... wrote:


True, unfortunately my system is sized so that I still have to purchase a pretty significant amount, especially since I bought two EVs.  I have only had a negative monthly bill a handful of times under GME's 1:1 plan the past 4 years.  Although I do sell quite a lot, the increased purchase price is more important for my situation than the change to not allow monthly rollover.  When my current contract expires it will be a tricky decision.

Will

On Oct 4, 2021 10:47 AM, Fred Anders <fjanders1@...> wrote:
On Mon, Oct 4, 2021 at 07:09 AM, <w_h_3@...> wrote:
Called Rhythm..their 1:1 plan has electricity price that is sadly around 6 cents more per kWh than their normal plans, which I think is in ballpark of GM or even more.  They do offer buyback in their regular plans but of only the energy charge, not the delivery charge.  I don’t know if Green Mountain even offers that.
If your system offsets 100% or more of your annual usage (i.e. your exported kWhs exceed your imported kWhs), then it doesn't matter what 1:1 ¢/kWh rate they charge since you'll never pay it. (Even if you only offset most -- but not all -- of your consumption, a high-rate 1:1 plan often still works out to be the best option.)

GME's [unadvertised] "Renewable Rewards Essential" plan is similar to Rhythm's "Texas Breeze" plans in that it charges energy+delivery in, and only credits for energy out. But the GME plan doesn't roll over credits month to month.



Mellen West
 

I have no problem with consuming as much energy as you need to maintain your lifestyle if it is 100% renewable and produced on your roof or ground mount. I gets more complicated when you introduce grid reliance but that can be solved.  The problem is very few people have the means and space to do it.  The great class divide rears its ugly head.

Mellen

 

From: main@NTREG.groups.io <main@NTREG.groups.io> On Behalf Of R. Michael Martin
Sent: Monday, 4 October, 2021 4:42 PM
To: main@NTREG.groups.io
Subject: Re: [NTREG] Green Mountain Energy

 

“...run your lights and television continuously and consume as much electricity as you can.”  <<<Surely not at that is counter to the overall direction and mentality of reduce/reuse of clean energy folks (guessing you were kidding ;-)  

 

Let’s advocate for fair consumer policies and REP offerings for solar users and seek reduction and more efficiencies in overall power use.

 

 

On Oct 4, 2021, at 16:30, Jim Cochran via groups.io <jimcochran.jd@...> wrote:

 

Correct the fact that they now do it on a billing cycle monthly means that you don’t carry your surplus from the spa fall or spring into the summer so that you can even out the year to a net of 0.  If the cycle were on a yearly basis instead of monthly then it would be a little more equitable

 

So one question to me is with the excess electricity that they make in the spring and fall do they just sell it and profit off your generation?  Probably yes

 

So I guess the answer in the spring and fall is to run your lights and television continuously and consume as much electricity as you can

Sent from Jim Cochran



On Oct 4, 2021, at 12:46 PM, w_h_3@... wrote:



True, unfortunately my system is sized so that I still have to purchase a pretty significant amount, especially since I bought two EVs.  I have only had a negative monthly bill a handful of times under GME's 1:1 plan the past 4 years.  Although I do sell quite a lot, the increased purchase price is more important for my situation than the change to not allow monthly rollover.  When my current contract expires it will be a tricky decision.

 

Will

 

On Oct 4, 2021 10:47 AM, Fred Anders <fjanders1@...> wrote:

On Mon, Oct 4, 2021 at 07:09 AM, <w_h_3@...> wrote:

Called Rhythm..their 1:1 plan has electricity price that is sadly around 6 cents more per kWh than their normal plans, which I think is in ballpark of GM or even more.  They do offer buyback in their regular plans but of only the energy charge, not the delivery charge.  I don’t know if Green Mountain even offers that.

If your system offsets 100% or more of your annual usage (i.e. your exported kWhs exceed your imported kWhs), then it doesn't matter what 1:1 ¢/kWh rate they charge since you'll never pay it. (Even if you only offset most -- but not all -- of your consumption, a high-rate 1:1 plan often still works out to be the best option.)

GME's [unadvertised] "Renewable Rewards Essential" plan is similar to Rhythm's "Texas Breeze" plans in that it charges energy+delivery in, and only credits for energy out. But the GME plan doesn't roll over credits month to month.

 

 


richjern@...
 
Edited

But no energy source is 100% renewable. Solar panels and wind turbines require energy and materials for their manufacturing, not to mention the energy required for transport and installation. Battery backup, same story. In fact, I can see issues down the road with lithium mining and availability that will be akin to our present issues with oil and gas. So flagrant consumption doesn’t get a free pass, even in a renewable world.


Larry
 

Re: But no energy source is 100% renewable - 

I would contend that 90+% is a lot better than the greenhouse gas emissions we have now. Energy to produce solar panels and wind turbines and their materials can be produced from renewable energy, as well as for their transportation and installation. The same for battery production and materials. Beginning of life and end of life for solar panels, wind turbines, and batteries need to have attention. However, unlike oil and gas when used to produce energy by combustion, wind and solar do not generate emissions while generating the energy we need - which is a BIG difference in lifetime emissions.


R. Michael Martin
 

don’t let perfect be the enemy of (damn) good!


On Oct 5, 2021, at 08:47, Larry via groups.io <rlhowejr@...> wrote:

Re: But no energy source is 100% renewable - 

I would contend that 90+% is a lot better than the greenhouse gas emissions we have now. Energy to produce solar panels and wind turbines and their materials can be produced from renewable energy, as well as for their transportation and installation. The same for battery production and materials. Beginning of life and end of life for solar panels, wind turbines, and batteries need to have attention. However, unlike oil and gas when used to produce energy by combustion, wind and solar do not generate emissions while generating the energy we need - which is a BIG difference in lifetime emissions.


Lydia Miller
 

Yeah, I haven’t heard a lot of people decrying the carbon footprint of building coal or natural gas plants….

On Oct 5, 2021, at 9:40 AM, R. Michael Martin <mm@...> wrote:

 don’t let perfect be the enemy of (damn) good!


On Oct 5, 2021, at 08:47, Larry via groups.io <rlhowejr@...> wrote:

Re: But no energy source is 100% renewable - 

I would contend that 90+% is a lot better than the greenhouse gas emissions we have now. Energy to produce solar panels and wind turbines and their materials can be produced from renewable energy, as well as for their transportation and installation. The same for battery production and materials. Beginning of life and end of life for solar panels, wind turbines, and batteries need to have attention. However, unlike oil and gas when used to produce energy by combustion, wind and solar do not generate emissions while generating the energy we need - which is a BIG difference in lifetime emissions.


richjern@...
 

“Don’t let the perfect be the enemy of the (damn) good.” Totally agree. Still, the person with the giant solar powered home and 5 EVs has got a big carbon footprint. I’m 100% on board with green tech. Just stating it doesn’t mean we can keep on indulging our bad habits.


Jim Duncan
 

THis is a slide from a 2019 presentation I gave to the Texas Campaign For The Environment. It illustrates the amount of carbon dioxide equivalent generated during the lifetime of PV. 

Jim Duncan
Solar Acres Farm
817.917.0527
solarguy2004@...
On 10/4/2021 10:31 PM, richjern via groups.io wrote:

But no energy source is 100% renewable. Solar panels and wind turbines require energy and materials for their manufacturing, not to mention the energy required for transport and installation. Battery backup, same story. In fancy, I can see issues down the road with lithium mining and availability that will be akin to our present issues with oil and gas. So flagrant consumption doesn’t get a free pass, even in a renewable world.